bleh, whine

[extrapenguin]

Guardian rewatchalong, ep 12 is up!

All in all, this week has been pretty successful fic-wise, in that I've started publishing that 40k work for MDZS and put out that Guardian breeding kink one. (My Guardian porn log still has #5 from here and a Shen Wei/Ye Zun/Zhao Yunlan threesome that are written and need editing that is less than the editing the prior porn log ones needed, so yay!)

However. I know it's only one shortish chapter for the MDZS work, but the response has been abysmal. Some of it is on the form of presentation – though I didn't expect quite as big an allergy to undisclosed endgame ship fic – and the rest ... idk. My other works haven't gone down as badly! I know I write more thought-provoking fic for a fandom mostly reveling in quick emotional hits, but bleh. If I hadn't already written all of it, I'd abandon the WIP. :P (Even now that I have, I'm still sorely tempted. Never let it be said that penguins aren't touchy.)

I've decided to participate in a mini-rumble. I have one challenge done, but the "close crop" thing is surprisingly hard. I have several candidates but none of them work! There's no voting, though, so I guess I'll try once more tomorrow, then pick the one I most want concrit on and submit. Bleh. (Edit: Complaining about it on the internet worked! I have made one more and submitted my icons.)

(Other activities for the weekend: editing fic, incl. 520 assignment. Writing something short for the TGE filthfest. Posting ch 2 of the MDZS WIP.)

Oh yeah I'm also coming down with the flu! That is not fun. I hate it.

Comments

[rheasilvia]

Yay for successful ficcage - and iconage, too! I am continually impressed at your creative energy.

It sucks the response on the MDZS work hasn't been what you hoped for so far - that is always demoralizing. :-/ But nooo, please don't let that stop you from writing what you want to write!! I suspect you're right and it is the uncertainty of the endgame pairing. Many fans are very attached to their OTPs, after all... it may be that they are just holding off on reading until they have certainty.

You know, this would be an interesting topic for a poll: how much importance do readers place on the certainty of a certain pairing being endgame? I honestly don't know how many OTPers there are, as compared to more free-flowing readers.

Sorry to hear about the flu!!! I second the recommendation for tea. (I have also had some success with zinc supplements, after having consecutive colds for about two months on end. But they are definitely not as delicious. *g*)

[extrapenguin]

Yay for successful ficcage - and iconage, too! I am continually impressed at your creative energy.
♥ Thank you! It seems I am overflowing with creative energy. If only there were more hours in the day!

It sucks the response on the MDZS work hasn't been what you hoped for so far - that is always demoralizing. :-/ But nooo, please don't let that stop you from writing what you want to write!!
Actually, I'm pivoting to Guardian, where I consistently get more and better comments! MDZS-style comments are often simply "Woah" or "Thanks for the update. 😊" and occasionally it feels like pouring salt on the wound. I wrote all these words, and you can't even say that you liked one thing?! Whereas for Guardian, I'm much more likely to get comments that state they liked X thing, or occasionally meaty multiparagraph ones. And as much as it's nice that anyone reads a fic, I really prefer the ones where it's clear that the person actually engaged with it even in the limited amount that is "I liked specific thing X". Writing is a craft; I would take one comment that commented on my craft over an infinite amount that basically compliment my ability to figure out the AO3 posting interface... /end rant

I suspect you're right and it is the uncertainty of the endgame pairing. Many fans are very attached to their OTPs, after all... it may be that they are just holding off on reading until they have certainty.
I'll tag it with the endgame pairing about 48h after it's done and posted. Several people have stated they're enthused about seeing a fic where they can try to guess and anticipate the endgame ship (...on Discord, instead of as comments on the actual fic), so there is an audience for that, but idk. Most people in this fandom are in it for the juggernaut, but they've demostrated perfect willingness to go "When are A and B getting together?" on fic that's explicitly tagged as A/C. In conclusion: grumble.

You know, this would be an interesting topic for a poll: how much importance do readers place on the certainty of a certain pairing being endgame? I honestly don't know how many OTPers there are, as compared to more free-flowing readers.
Indeed it would be interesting! I am a chronic multishipper, so there's stuff where I don't click because it looks unappealing (whether because pairing or other tag), but there are people who don't read anything save their OTP. And even in OTP works, skim over anything that isn't their OTP interacting.

ETA: With regards to the creative energies, I recalled an Isaac Asimov quote on being a prolific author: “You must not like much of anything but writing.” That is ... perhaps sadly apt in my case. I greatly enjoy living inside my mind, imagining things, and one of my favorite means of interaction is sharing my imaginations, since that way I can continue being my chronically single weirdo loner self yet achieve human interaction! Ah, fandom; how I love thee.

[rheasilvia]

It's so interesting how even the style of commenting changes from fandom to fandom. O_O

Most people in this fandom are in it for the juggernaut, but they've demostrated perfect willingness to go "When are A and B getting together?" on fic that's explicitly tagged as A/C. In conclusion: grumble.

Where A and B are the juggernaut pairing? Sigh... yeah, that'd definitely make me grumbly too! Read the tags, people.

I'm not generally a multishipper and do have an OTP in most fandoms. I am not only interested in reading about the OTP; if the story sounds interesting, I like to read gen, or pairings that don't include either of my OTP, or stories where my OTP is not the main or only focus. However, I am most often so emotionally invested in my OTP that I would end up genuinely sad (and possibly distressed) after reading a story that pairs up one of my OTP characters with someone else as the endgame... so if the endgame pairing was not certain, I would also hold off on reading.

Several people have stated they're enthused about seeing a fic where they can try to guess and anticipate the endgame ship (...on Discord, instead of as comments on the actual fic), so there is an audience for that

It certainly does hold a lot of suspense and interest! In a non-OTP fandom, I too would be quite enthused. :-)

About the poll: Let's make one and see what people say! If you prefer, I can, although it will take me a little while to get to it since I am insanely busy just now. But I do really want to know what people think, and the discussion should be very interesting!

I recalled an Isaac Asimov quote on being a prolific author: “You must not like much of anything but writing.”

I often think of a letter Franz Kafka wrote to his fiancee in which he complains that *everything* about life bores him with the sole exception of writing (not excepting reading, or talking about writing). He ends with a rather last-minute segue into saying the best thing would be to sit at her feet and be silent, but it's pretty clear that would actually bore him. ;-)

Isaac Asimov is a far more uplifting example, though!

I greatly enjoy living inside my mind, imagining things, and one of my favorite means of interaction is sharing my imaginations, since that way I can continue being my chronically single weirdo loner self yet achieve human interaction! Ah, fandom; how I love thee.

Me too!! Fandom is wonderful for bringing together imaginative people and allowing them to live inside a world built by their collective imagination. It can be so incredibly interesting and rewarding!

[extrapenguin]

Commenting is a function of fandom culture. A fandom based mostly on Dreamwidth, full of olds who are also writers themselves, will comment much differently to a fandom based mostly on Twitter.

I am not only interested in reading about the OTP; if the story sounds interesting, I like to read gen, or pairings that don't include either of my OTP, or stories where my OTP is not the main or only focus. However, I am most often so emotionally invested in my OTP that I would end up genuinely sad (and possibly distressed) after reading a story that pairs up one of my OTP characters with someone else as the endgame.
You are already more into a bunch of MDZS fandom, who seemingly only read stuff if their OTP is being cute in it. :P

TBH I don't think I understand the OTP thing. Any OTP-like fandom is either actually not an OTP fandom (even with Guardian, I am okay with Zhao Yunlan/Shen Wei/Ye Zun) or just something where I, personally, only care enough to ship one thing, but as long as A/Z is not a NOTP, I'd happily read it, even if it's not my fave ship A/B.

About the poll: Let's make one and see what people say! If you prefer, I can, although it will take me a little while to get to it since I am insanely busy just now. But I do really want to know what people think, and the discussion should be very interesting!
I think I'd like for you to make it, so I (and my flist) get some distance from this whinge/time to digest the matter! What should the options be – simply a question of "Which do you prefer?" and the answer options "A fic with clearly tagged endgame pairing" and "A fic where I can get psyched about predicting the endgame pairing"? Something else? (I guess fandom dependency might also be a thing?)

Franz Kafka wrote to his fiancee in which he complains that *everything* about life bores him with the sole exception of writing (not excepting reading, or talking about writing).
Ahaha poor Franz Kafka, poor Franz Kafka's fiancée! The Asimov quote is indeed nicer in some ways. :P

[rheasilvia]

A fandom based mostly on Dreamwidth, full of olds who are also writers themselves, will comment much differently to a fandom based mostly on Twitter.

Very true! And now I am reminded of the time some BNFs from a huge yaoi fandom - Gundam Wing, I think? - happened across the Eroica With Love fandom, which was comparatively ancient, small and full of staid old fans not in other manga/yaoi fandoms (including me *g*). They stormed onto the mailing list and things promptly proceeded to be very culture clashy. It was kind of hilarious. ;-)

TBH I don't think I understand the OTP thing.

That's really interesting - and yeah, I get how all the OTPing seems odd and frustrating, under those circumstances. I think that for me, it has to do with a combination of identifying with (at least one of) the characters, and feeling they won't find the happiness I want for them outside of the OTP. So even when the author writes a happy ending for the alternate pairing, to me it feels heartbreakingly sad, and in some cases deeply upsetting.

I'll have to think about it some more!

I think I'd like for you to make it, so I (and my flist) get some distance from this whinge/time to digest the matter!

Then I will! I'd ask some general questions about whether people have OTPs at all and how exclusive they are, if / to what extent it depends on the fandom, what exactly an OTP means to them, and then also about the specific tagging question. If there are any general fannish discussion comms we could like it there, though I am not up to date on those! It will just take me a bit, since I want to finish these stories first, argh.

[extrapenguin]

They stormed onto the mailing list and things promptly proceeded to be very culture clashy. It was kind of hilarious. ;-)
Ahh yeah I can sympathize! All that new culture and lingo and such.

I think that for me, it has to do with a combination of identifying with (at least one of) the characters, and feeling they won't find the happiness I want for them outside of the OTP.
This is odd! I generally don't identify that much with characters, but if I do, it manifests mostly as a broad DNW of relationship dynamics I dislike. OTOH I'd happily read anything outside that. Hmm.

Yay, a poll! fictional_fans is the largest multifandom discussion comm on DW that I'm aware of, should you wish to host a larger discussion.