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extrapenguinI've done all of today's IRL todo list, time to talk about Ye Zun! Spoilers through the whole TV series. I shall not touch the novel, since Ye Zun doesn't exist there.
We see him in canon, and know how he is as a villain, but I'd actually argue that all of that is a mask. We see him put on what I see as a very intentional performance of bravado and confidence. However, that's not his "true" personality, that's the metaphorical mask he wears to go with his literal one.
Much has been made about Shen Wei's mask(s), and as Shen Wei's color palette swapped identical twin and narrative foil, Ye Zun also wears a mask. We don't hear him say why he wears the mask, but given that no-one else wears one fulltime, it's no widespread Dixingian custom. At one point he mentions hating his face, because it looks so much like his brother's, but when it comes to invading Haixing, he could just as well do it without a mask and ruin Shen Wei's reputation as an aside, and yet he doesn't. I suspect his reasons for keeping on the mask are similar to what drove Shen Wei to donning his: he wants to hide his youth, inexperience, fear, and appear to be the supervillain he wants to be.
But all of that is performance. We see the metaphorical mask crack when the literal one does: the final episodes have Ye Zun descend into ranting. No-one ever asked him why he was doing what he was doing. While Zhao Yunlan reached out to young Shen Wei as Kunlun, no-one did that to Ye Zun. Combined with Ye Zun's jealous outburst in the time travel episode ("I've always put you first in my heart, gege, but in your heart, others have always come before me.") and his final conversations with Zhao Yunlan when everything is disintegrating, I find it hard to believe he's anything but how we saw him in the Ye Zun shot that comes first in the timeline: someone who's been hurt and broken and trod over by circumstances, and who's learned that people are out to get him. The manipulation is a powerless child's attempt at exerting control over his environment. We see Ye Zun as a victim of the original rebel leader; from that moment, he had perhaps a month or so* of ruling the rebels before he was stuffed into his pillar.
When gaining control of the rebels, Ye Zun learned that might makes right. Another thing he must've learned, based on his interactions with his subordinates in the present, is that people are terrible, and one must hurt them–betray them–abandon them before they hurt–betray–abandon you, because they will do it. Compare this to Shen Wei, who is mistrustful of Haixingians, and thinks e.g. the SID will hurt him, based on his valid fears and Zhao Xinci's attitude, but gets proven wrong when he lets Zhao Yunlan and the SID closer to him despite this fear, and finds that they accept him just fine. Shen Wei could do this because he set himself up to nobly suffer and be the bigger person (and because he was very thirsty for Kunlun content). Ye Zun couldn't do this, because he did not have the security and "internal power base" that would give the necessary margin for error.
In conclusion, Ye Zun as we know him is paranoid, and cruel, and above all utterly terrified of letting people close enough they could hurt him, but he still craves attachment with people, because if human is a social animal, so is a Dixingian. All the bombast is a performance where he tries to convince himself that he deserves to take up this space around him when his confidence has been abused out of him. My problem is this: what do I do with him after that moment of crisis where he discovers that his assumptions about his brother were incorrect, and our heroes can begin to unravel the lies the original rebel leader told him? Who does Ye Zun become, if given a chance to heal? The same scared child, reminiscent of Guo Changcheng, but allowed to fear and cry and be comforted? A prickly brat who pushes at every boundary to try and invoke the punishment he's familar with, because this security and love is too much, too weird for him? A slightly more apologetic and remorseful Shen Wei? I suppose it'd depend on the nature of redemption, and where it diverged from canon, but I'm lost at sea, searching for land. Thoughts are welcome.
* We see Zhao Yunlan instruct Ma Gui on wine-making, and then be present to see the results of said wine-making. (Episodes relating to the Yashou tribe leadership twig.) Fermenting baijiu takes a month or two, depending on how one does it, so we can reasonably conclude that Zhao Yunlan was in the past for at least a month.
We see him in canon, and know how he is as a villain, but I'd actually argue that all of that is a mask. We see him put on what I see as a very intentional performance of bravado and confidence. However, that's not his "true" personality, that's the metaphorical mask he wears to go with his literal one.
Much has been made about Shen Wei's mask(s), and as Shen Wei's color palette swapped identical twin and narrative foil, Ye Zun also wears a mask. We don't hear him say why he wears the mask, but given that no-one else wears one fulltime, it's no widespread Dixingian custom. At one point he mentions hating his face, because it looks so much like his brother's, but when it comes to invading Haixing, he could just as well do it without a mask and ruin Shen Wei's reputation as an aside, and yet he doesn't. I suspect his reasons for keeping on the mask are similar to what drove Shen Wei to donning his: he wants to hide his youth, inexperience, fear, and appear to be the supervillain he wants to be.
But all of that is performance. We see the metaphorical mask crack when the literal one does: the final episodes have Ye Zun descend into ranting. No-one ever asked him why he was doing what he was doing. While Zhao Yunlan reached out to young Shen Wei as Kunlun, no-one did that to Ye Zun. Combined with Ye Zun's jealous outburst in the time travel episode ("I've always put you first in my heart, gege, but in your heart, others have always come before me.") and his final conversations with Zhao Yunlan when everything is disintegrating, I find it hard to believe he's anything but how we saw him in the Ye Zun shot that comes first in the timeline: someone who's been hurt and broken and trod over by circumstances, and who's learned that people are out to get him. The manipulation is a powerless child's attempt at exerting control over his environment. We see Ye Zun as a victim of the original rebel leader; from that moment, he had perhaps a month or so* of ruling the rebels before he was stuffed into his pillar.
When gaining control of the rebels, Ye Zun learned that might makes right. Another thing he must've learned, based on his interactions with his subordinates in the present, is that people are terrible, and one must hurt them–betray them–abandon them before they hurt–betray–abandon you, because they will do it. Compare this to Shen Wei, who is mistrustful of Haixingians, and thinks e.g. the SID will hurt him, based on his valid fears and Zhao Xinci's attitude, but gets proven wrong when he lets Zhao Yunlan and the SID closer to him despite this fear, and finds that they accept him just fine. Shen Wei could do this because he set himself up to nobly suffer and be the bigger person (and because he was very thirsty for Kunlun content). Ye Zun couldn't do this, because he did not have the security and "internal power base" that would give the necessary margin for error.
In conclusion, Ye Zun as we know him is paranoid, and cruel, and above all utterly terrified of letting people close enough they could hurt him, but he still craves attachment with people, because if human is a social animal, so is a Dixingian. All the bombast is a performance where he tries to convince himself that he deserves to take up this space around him when his confidence has been abused out of him. My problem is this: what do I do with him after that moment of crisis where he discovers that his assumptions about his brother were incorrect, and our heroes can begin to unravel the lies the original rebel leader told him? Who does Ye Zun become, if given a chance to heal? The same scared child, reminiscent of Guo Changcheng, but allowed to fear and cry and be comforted? A prickly brat who pushes at every boundary to try and invoke the punishment he's familar with, because this security and love is too much, too weird for him? A slightly more apologetic and remorseful Shen Wei? I suppose it'd depend on the nature of redemption, and where it diverged from canon, but I'm lost at sea, searching for land. Thoughts are welcome.
* We see Zhao Yunlan instruct Ma Gui on wine-making, and then be present to see the results of said wine-making. (Episodes relating to the Yashou tribe leadership twig.) Fermenting baijiu takes a month or two, depending on how one does it, so we can reasonably conclude that Zhao Yunlan was in the past for at least a month.
no subject
Date: 2019-01-25 22:40 (UTC)But yeah, at this point I can't really separate what canon intended for Ye Zun and what I have read into canon and added to and tweaked until I have something that makes sense to me?
I'm glad you've picked up on Zhao Yunlan's reaction to Ye Zun - that is indeed the first building block for everything that is to comes. (You can have compassion even for people who have done terrible things - and a big fat yes to restorative justice!) Canon unfortunately did the thing where Yunlan only confronted Ye Zun about what he wanted after Shen Wei was already (as good as) dead, and so... that's not really a conversation that could ever go anywhere?
It makes me really hopeful that in canon, Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei both agree that there are things more important than rules and punishment - there is no justice in punishing a child, for example. Especially not one who only killed her abuser! I also feel that the show's attitude towards Sang Zan hints at there being virtue in forgiving past mistakes - dude straight up murdered Ge Lan's family (which one could argue was justified - but then he went ahead and murdered more folks in revenge for killing Ge Lan), and she still wants to be with him in their afterlife and the SID totally adopt him.
no subject
Date: 2019-01-25 23:15 (UTC)He wasn't ever in the foreground enough that I think any of us can do it. I've even encountered people who think he'd be some master manipulator enjoying manipulating people, which I think just isn't him – it's the shell beneath which Ye Zun exists. I do think he's part of the series' theme of "if you're looking for revenge, you should just rethink it and not get vengeance on the wrong person, stupid" that we saw with e.g. Sha Ya and Merit Brush Dude.
Alas. Had Zhao Yunlan been inclined to chat with Ye Zun in the opportunities he was given, or had another opportunity to chat with him, things might've turned out differently. After all, Zhao Yunlan is an astute observer of people, and also generally inclined to be merciful. He doesn't hate easily; the only person we see him hate in-show is Ye Zun after Ye Zun has easten Shen Wei. If handed the knowledge that Ye Zun and Shen Wei were related before the very end of the time travel segment, he'd likely try to see if Ye Zun could be redeemed, if only for Shen Wei's peace of mind.
Big yes on both Zhao Yunlan and Shen Wei being into the spirit of the law instead of simply the letter. Shen Wei was willing to let Sha Ya and her flowershop friend stay above ground, and they let Ya Qing live in peace once she defected. Chu Shuzhi is allowed to be a SID member, even if he killed people and tried to convince xiao-Guo he's a cannibal. And the bit with Sang Zan, too. It's very ... one can let go of one's past and change sides. They even let Cong Bo join the team despite his earlier antagonism towards them. The SID is, at heart, very forgiving of people who admit they were wrong.
no subject
Date: 2019-01-27 20:17 (UTC)Wow - I hadn't even considered doing that, but yeah. There's a LOT of meta underneath it all. I wrote daily bits (1-2k words, usually) and sent them to Xparrot, who would then give me an insta-reaction, which would let me go if I was going in the wrong direction or not. There were a couple of wrong turns, including a major one with Ye Zun I have hopefully fixed satisfactorily? But those kind of things lead to a lot of discussion between the two of us.
Alas. Had Zhao Yunlan been inclined to chat with Ye Zun in the opportunities he was given, or had another opportunity to chat with him, things might've turned out differently.
I am absolutely convinced it would have. Zhao Yunlan has such capacity for compassion, and that's - something Ye Zun really, really has not had much of in his life. And of course, with his love for Shen Wei, he'd want Shen Wei to have his brother back.
The SID is, at heart, very forgiving of people who admit they were wrong.
And I really do love this about them. <333
no subject
Date: 2019-01-27 21:29 (UTC)Once you're done, I'd actually like to have an entire self-indulgent post of "here's what I almost did, but didn't for this reason" etc; I'm always super interested in others' creative processes and what they considered doing but chose against, and why.
Yup! It's what I really like about Zhao Yunlan. And he'd definitely be a positive influence on Ye Zun, just like he was on Shen Wei.
no subject
Date: 2019-01-31 20:09 (UTC)Yup! It's what I really like about Zhao Yunlan. And he'd definitely be a positive influence on Ye Zun, just like he was on Shen Wei.
Yessss, I can absolutely see this.
no subject
Date: 2019-01-31 21:09 (UTC)